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Rejecting Fact for Faith: the Inexplicable and Inexcusable Silencing of the PGAL’s Child Client

When a PGAL (private guardian ad litem) is appointed to represent children in a child custody dispute in a Utah divorce case, it would sure be good to know what the PGAL and the children actually said to each other (not merely believe, not trust any second-hand source’s claims as to what the children purportedly said, but know what the children said) by having a by having an audio and/or sound-and-video recording of the what the PGAL and the children actually said to each other. I am not aware of any evidence that proves or so much as suggests that having such a record is (is, not may be, but is) prejudicial or harmful to anyone.

The reasons why should be obvious.

I don’t have to believe you if you tell me that your fingerprints are not on the murder weapon. In contrast, I cannot deny your fingerprints aren’t on the murder weapon, when you show me the murder weapon has none of your fingerprints on it.

If you had an eye witness who could provide you with an alibi, you would need the witness himself to testify. You couldn’t say to the judge or jury, “Trust me, I have an eye witness, and if he were here, he’d tell you that Mickey shot Jerry, not me.” The only way to know if such a witness really exists and is not just a convenient figment of your imagination is to hear from the witness himself. Indeed, if you tried to speak for a phantom witness, that would be inadmissible hearsay. Objective fact is self-evidently more probative than unverified stories and claims. This is why we don’t rely on hearsay when we can hear first-hand from the witness.

You wouldn’t want people trying to put words in your mouth and misrepresenting what you do and do not say. It’s why the rule against hearsay exists, and for good reason. It’s why the public rose up and demanded bodycams for police (because the police were caught lying so much and chronically violating innocent people’s rights in the process). It’s why we need verifiable proof that medicine actually works and aircraft can safely takeoff, fly, and land before we use them.

Yet PGALs in Utah all but universally refuse to interview children on the record and oppose children being questioned by anyone else on the record. Instead, PGALs expect that everyone believe 1) what the PGAL claims to have asked the children in the PGAL’s interviews with them and 2) what the PGAL claims the children said in response 3) and to believe the PGALs without the children being subject to cross-examination. “Believe the PGAL on what basis?,” you may ask. Merely being appointed as a PGAL. That’s like expecting one to believe a witness in court merely because the witness swore an oath to tell the truth (which would be as unreasonable as it is irresponsible). Being a PGAL doesn’t render one incapable of lying or incapable of misperceiving or misremembering details. Being a PGAL free the PGAL from personal biases and prejudices that hamper impartiality and sound judgment.[1]

Even if someone subjectively believed a PGAL were infallible and could never lie and never misperceive reality, subjective belief would not make it so. It could not make it so. Subjective belief is inherently not, and inherently can never be, superior to objectively verifiable fact. 

Yet the courts indulge—and knowingly indulge—in this kind of thing all the time. “Trust that the PGAL is telling us the truth because he/she is a PGAL,” or “We don’t need to hear from the children directly, the PGAL speaks for them.” It would be one thing if a PGAL claimed to speak for a child client and the child client at least went on the record to verify, “Yes, what the PGAL just proffered is correct,” but we don’t even have that. Once a PGAL is appointed, the child is rarely—if ever—heard from himself/herself. Even when the child is willing to testify. I’m not kidding. I’m not exaggerating.

Sometimes we don’t have objective proof. Sometimes all we have to go on is believing (or not believing) someone’s word. But belief is plainly not the highest standard of proof (thank goodness). When we can rely on fact over faith, we are morally, intellectually, and legally obligated to do so. 

When accuracy and truth matter (and when do they not?) and if and when we can hear directly from that particular person himself/herself, no one should “trust” what anyone (not just you–anyone) says someone else allegedly said.

Any PGAL who would assert, “I have or could have objective verification for my claims, but I refuse to provide such verification; take my word for it,” is a PGAL no one can be obligated to believe. I ask sincerely: how can any PGAL or judge or commissioner who believes that the PGAL serves to silence a child client’s own voice be trusted?

Utah Family Law, LC | divorceutah.com | 801-466-9277


[1] Indeed, if we took every word of the PGAL as gospel, we wouldn’t need a judge to do anything other than rubber stamp what the PGAL says. If the PGAL says the children claim Dad beat them, well then, that’s what the children said—after all, the PGAL says so. No need to inquire into whether the children were coached, coerced, brainwashed, or chose to lie. And because the law in Utah is construed to mean that children “represented” by PGALs are prohibited from speaking for themselves, no inquiry with the children on the record will ever take place. Does that look like “fact” finding, like due process, like a just and equitable process to you?

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